Why do you choose a date for your event to coincide with the Christian celebration of the incarnation of Jesus Christ?

What does "an admirer of Jesus" do with His teaching? What does it even mean? Jesus did not come in human form to be admired. In fact, he had great disdain for those who followed him without belief. He chastised them for their practices, and their desire for signs and wonders.

The Incarnation of Jesus has zero to with admiration. It has everything to do with God's fulfillment of prophecy and God's purpose. God's plan was redemption of mankind. Redemption is about an eternal destiny, not about those with "less of material advantages." Spiritually, everybody is broken, and in need. Jesus never came to deal with making people prosperous. His commands regarding those will less was directed to His followers as a response to what He has done, and their acceptance of the gift of salvation.

I'm really confused with those who try to use Jesus as a reason for their behaviors and actions, yet refuse to believe what He says. This makes no sense. It is akin to the atheist putting up a Christmas tree in their home, and "celebrating" Christmas. How confusing? To what end?

The only value to Christmas is directed toward the Incarnation of Jesus Christ. All other responses are hollow and void of any meaning.

James, still looking for an explanation of what it means to be an "admirer of Jesus Christ." Thank you.

cc- I agree. I have talked to them about that very thing. They have upped their marketing approach for which follows splashing their news all over the place, and in every which way they can. Still, its a great organization in spite of such annoyance.

"... secular Christmas ..." Oh my!!! Some people are really confused. Thanks for confirming my previous post.

Happy Saturnalia, Roger! :-)

Of course, Scott, but it's not a question of siding with one or the other, both secular and several religious holidays are observed this time of year. Why not enjoy as many as you wish!
Since Judaism came long before Christianity, and Dec. 25 as Christmas was decided to replace Saturnalia, I thought this information from JudaismOnline might be of interest to readers here:

In the 4th century CE, Christianity imported the Saturnalia festival hoping to take the pagan masses in with it, and succeeded in converting large numbers of pagans by promising them that they could continue to celebrate the Saturnalia as Christians.

(continued)

The problem was that there was nothing Christian about Saturnalia so these Christian leaders named Saturnalia’s concluding day, December 25th, Jesus’ birthday.
Christians had little success, however, refining the practices of Saturnalia. As Stephen Nissenbaum, professor history at the University of Massachussetts, Amherst, writes, “In return for ensuring massive observance of the anniversary of the Savior’s birth by assigning it to this resonant date, the Church for its part tacitly agreed to allow the holiday to be celebrated more or less the way it had always been.” Hence the earliest Christmas holidays were celebrated by drinking, sexual indulgence, singing naked in the streets.
Rev. Increase Mather of Boston observed in 1687 that “the early Christians who first observed the Nativity on December 25 did not do so thinking that Christ was born in that Month, but because the Heathens’ Saturnalia was at that time kept in Rome, and they were willing to have those Pagan Holidays metamorphosed into Christian ones." Because of its known pagan origin, Christmas was banned by the Puritans and its observance was illegal in Massachusetts between 1659 and 1681 However, Christmas was and still is celebrated by most Christians.

(conclusion)

Some of the most depraved customs of the Saturnalia carnival were intentionally revived by the Catholic Church in 1466 when Pope Paul II, for the amusement of his Roman citizens, forced Jews to race naked through the streets of the city. ....On December 25, 1881, Christian leaders whipped the Polish masses into Antisemitic frenzies that led to riots across the country. In Warsaw 12 Jews were brutally murdered, huge numbers maimed, and many Jewish women were raped.
Merry Christmas!
And happy holidays to all!

NE ... while your C & P of history may be right, it has zero to do with the celebration of the Incarnation. These are common rebuttals to celebrating the Incarnation "in our own way," which are only deflecting the point. The history lesson is irrelevant to the reason for the Incarnation.

To suggest "our own way ..." is a rejection of the person of Jesus Christ. This is rejecting the gift of salvation, the gift of an eternal destiny with the Creator, the Lord God Almighty. If saying this not to be the case, then please present to us your source of absolute truth regarding these matters, and the outcomes of your belief. No, we are not looking for "in my opinion," or "this is what I think." We need to hear your belief system, and the foundation of that belief system for your argument to hold any validity.

NE ... why not share your belief system? Your reluctance to do so leaves us with a couple of choices, either you are ignorant of what you believe and why, or you are unwilling to defend your belief system. Don't you know, or are you so unsure that you are not prepared to defend?

Your silence has nothing to do with how many holidays may or may not be celebrated.

Thanks for your wishes. You follow a path of some others, who, when asked to articulate their own beliefs, choose to opt out. Why is this so? Are you so unsure of what you believe that you are unwilling, or unable, to articulate them? Are you so unsure of the basis of your belief that you find it wobbly when asked to speak it out?

Family bonding is fine on one level, but nothing about the question of eternal destiny. Celebrating in "many ways" is fine, but does nothing about the question of eternal destiny. Time off from work has nothing to do with the question of eternal destiny.

The ideas expressed above are not of my own construction, rather have a firm basis and foundation. The notion of eternity resides in the heart of all mankind. To deny is to delude one's self. For a very simple example, consider architectural history through the ages. Much of the effort of construction was done to deal with eternity future. Thinking the 2012 generation is different is misguided.

A Happy Holiday is very miniscule idea, when compared to joy knowing what eternity awaits the believer in the work of Jesus Christ. None of the joy is possible apart from His Incarnation. Without the Incarnation, there would be no Resurrection, and without the Resurrection, our faith is in vain. Every man is lost, and is unable to satisfy Justice on their own terms.

Roger
9:00 am on Saturday, December 1, 2012 Thanks for your wishes. You follow a path of some others, who, when asked to articulate their own beliefs, choose to opt out. Why is this so? Are you so unsure of what you believe that you are unwilling, or unable, to articulate them? Are you so unsure of the basis of your belief that you find it wobbly when asked to speak it out?

Not at all, I just don't think it is pertinent to this topic and only added my thoughts because I did not agree with your preaching at Barrington just because his chosen beliefs/celebrations/whatever were not lockstep with yours.
The point was that there are many holidays this time of year, some of those include gift giving, and I hope everyone enjoys whatever they celebrate.
You have no idea what PATH I follow, and I still wish you a happy holiday season, and hope that you can learn to accept the diversity that makes this world so amazingly interesting to me! I'm glad you accepted/thanked me for my good wishes to you, but you still seem unable to accept that not everyone believes as you do.
(Not saying how close or far from your beliefs mine happen to be...)

NE ... no lockstep here at all. What I have said is simple truths directly from the Bible. There is no preaching (your use of the term suggests you don't know what it means), only sharing the source of truth. I understand that some have trouble dealing with truth, but denial does not change anything.

NE ... one other thought. I may sound argumentative, but I have two concerns for everybody, not just you

First, spiritually, I deeply am concerned for anybody who does not have an assurance of a favorable eternal destiny. Apart from the person of Jesus Christ, everybody is eternally lost. That is the default position. This is why having the absolute truth is critically important. Just being defiant does nothing about the future, thinking "it will all work out." Everybody knows eternity in their heart, and must deal with the spiritual part of life. There is no basis for the "worm food" position.

Second, practically, our society is highly populated with people who are searching for peace. Guilt is eating up so many people. The process brings people to seek an escape. The escape mechanism takes many forms, including alcohol, drugs, materialism, career, relationships, etc. Every one of these paths prove themselves to be unsatisfying. The spiritual void cannot be filled with these paths. For the believer, there is forgiveness, a way to rid one's self of guilt, and an assurance of eternal destiny. The believer knows some things for certain, without reservation. I realize this sounds arrogant, but the Holy Spirit teaches and works along with man's spirit to understand these spiritual matters. No apologies.

My concern is for the spiritual well-being of others. Ignoring the matter is like leaving a precious gift at the door.

Roger
7:17 pm on Sunday, December 2, 2012 NE ... no lockstep here at all. What I have said is simple truths directly from the Bible.

that's very clear, but you must realize that not everyone believes in the Bible.
This is why I am not getting into debating my belief system vs yours, or how ours may be similar. It does not matter what YOU believe or what I believe, if you can't accept that others have different beliefs and theirs are just as valid for them!

Don't you semi-intellectual idiots realize that you cannot debate faith? Your facts are all correct, but that is where your intellect ends, NE1. If you attempt to debate faith, you will only spark a rage that you can never bottle back up. It is the perception of a threat to faith that sparks huge movements, like the Muslim Brotherhood or the Inquisition.

Inquiring about his definition of Incarnation is not akin to debate, dear Gerry.
Many people celebrate many things in many ways, so HAPPY HOLIDAYS to you , too!
And for the New Year, perhaps you'd consider less name calling and more kindness, it's not just for Christians you know.

So, Gerry, how are you celebrating the HOLIDAYS over in Hellertown? Get any snow yet? Do you care? c'mon, share with us!
HAPPY HOLIDAYS

NE12Ukid- Just looked at the posts again after two or three days off. I agree with the attitude you have about a pluralistic and diverse culture. To me it makes for a better world when we can accept without question our neighbor and stranger among us as a fellow human being who basically has the same needs we all do. Giving them the space they need and a friendly hello will go a long way to making a better world. - Thanks for the 'assist.' I have always felt that collegial (in this case, as human beings) respect was basic to all relationship.

James, how does pluralistic and diverse cultures make any difference toward one's eternal destiny. All the pluralism and cultural differences have no bearing on the matter.

What does these perspectives have to do with eternal destiny? Exchanging "Happy Holiday" may make you temporarily feel good about yourself, but does nothing about the your eternal future.

And saying MERRY CHRISTMAS does not insure YOUR "eternal destiny".

Nicely said, JS. I hope you are right about that improved tolerance, I have seen signs of it too, but such a long way to go----as these PATCH pages so often illustrate!

Well, James, I'm big on doing those things around the holidays that bring you joy, satisfaction, or bring such to others. Which is why I support your choices as they bring joy to you and yours. If you love baking and giving cookies to everyone around you, that can be a great way for you to celebrate the holiday. If going to church services does it for you, then that's what you should do. If singing carols, then sing! And if camping with the family is where you find your holiday joy, then enjoy that to the fullest extent you wish!